persisté dans les conclusions

English translation: reaffirmed the submissions/pleadings

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:persisté dans les conclusions
English translation:reaffirmed the submissions/pleadings
Entered by: Michael Meskers

18:44 Oct 22, 2021
French to English translations [PRO]
Law/Patents - Law (general)
French term or phrase: persisté dans les conclusions
Hi all -

I am translating a legal document from French (Switzerland). It describes the guardianship of a handicapped adult, referencing the previous assignment of a guardian which is now being transferred to another person.

I am not sure how to translate the phrase "persisté dans les conclusions" which appears within the following context:

Que l'avocat des appellants a, alors, persisté dans les conclusions formulées le 29 juin 2004, la cause étant retenue à juger le jour même;

Thanks for any help!

Michael
Michael Meskers
United States
Local time: 09:53
reaffirmed the submissions/pleadings
Explanation:
submissions/pleadings: FHS Bridge, Council of Europe Legal Dictionary.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 13 hrs (2021-10-23 07:51:45 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I would now suggest "application", in light of my Discussion entry.

Also there is some form of opposition here, as one of the parties is an "appellant", so maybe it's a simple difference of opinion, but maybe it's something more, like parties battling for guardianship.
Selected response from:

Conor McAuley
France
Local time: 15:53
Grading comment
Thanks!
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +3reaffirmed the submissions/pleadings
Conor McAuley
4 +2reaffirmed the factual and legal bases for their claims and defenses
Eliza Hall
4 -2reiterated the findings
Jean Lachaud
2stand / stood by the pleadings
Adrian MM.
3 -1repeated the same information
Lisa Rosengard
Summary of reference entries provided
Conclusions (juridique)
Eliza Hall

Discussion entries: 1





  

Answers


8 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): -2
reiterated the findings


Explanation:
pr anything along these lines

Jean Lachaud
United States
Local time: 09:53
Works in field
Native speaker of: French
PRO pts in category: 20

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Eliza Hall: Lawyers don't make findings. They can make PROPOSED findings, though (i.e. proposing that the court make XYZ findings).
1 hr

disagree  AllegroTrans: Lawyers don't make findings. Not "anything along these lines" - this is a legal document
2 hrs
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
reaffirmed the factual and legal bases for their claims and defenses


Explanation:
This is what it means, since "conclusions" means a legal document submitted by a party that sets forth the legal and factual reasons for which that party thinks it should win. In other words, the factual and legal bases for their claims (if they're the plaintiff) or defenses (if they're the defendant).

See the reference I posted, or just click this link: https://www.dictionnaire-juridique.com/definition/conclusion...

I'm using a straightforward explanatory translation because in the US legal system, there is no document that is the equivalent of FR "Conclusions." I'm not aware of any equivalent documents in British/Australian/etc. law either, though I leave it to my British, Aussie, etc. fellow translators to speak to that.

"Pleadings" doesn't work because it refers to several different documents (https://www.americanbar.org/groups/public_education/resource... and also because pleadings are not something a party needs to "persister" in (reaffirm, confirm, etc.). "Submissions" is too vague--it means anything and everything you filed, or everything you filed relating to a particular motion. It doesn't mean specifically your factual allegations and legal rationale.


Eliza Hall
United States
Local time: 09:53
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 145

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  AllegroTrans: If this was a plaintiff v defendant case I would be happy to agree, but quite possibly there is no defending party, just parties such as a doctor, social services, adult protection service etc.
47 mins
  -> Fair point, although I suppose you could adapt it to the case in question (i.e. omit "defenses," and possibly swap "claims" for "position").

neutral  Conor McAuley: Certainly a case well argued, but what Chris (AT) says makes sense.
10 hrs

agree  writeaway: Assuming the transfer was argued in court, this works well
12 hrs
  -> Merci.

agree  Yvonne Gallagher: with A/T and with w/a
2 days 14 hrs
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3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
persister / persisté dans les conclusions
stand / stood by the pleadings


Explanation:
> not the title of a song, but stand by the pleadings or Statement of Case in England + Wales where the numbered points or particulars of claim > les conclusions > can be repeated in the defenc/se statement or general 'traverse' aka blanket denial of the plaintiff's or claimant's case.

I haven't used other wordings in English legal drafting : mea culpa....., so low confidence level.

Example sentence(s):
  • "Counsel, do you acknowledge receipt of the Notification to Appear and waive formal reading of the charges? Do you stand by the pleadings?"
  • Do you stand by the pleadings? Hello all! This is a question in the immigration court legal context Thanks!

    Reference: http://forum.wordreference.com/threads/stand-by-the-pleading...
    Reference: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/english-to-spanish/law-general/502...
Adrian MM.
Austria
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 359

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  AllegroTrans: Never have heard this expression despite 25 years of attending court
14 days
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12 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +3
reaffirmed the submissions/pleadings


Explanation:
submissions/pleadings: FHS Bridge, Council of Europe Legal Dictionary.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 13 hrs (2021-10-23 07:51:45 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I would now suggest "application", in light of my Discussion entry.

Also there is some form of opposition here, as one of the parties is an "appellant", so maybe it's a simple difference of opinion, but maybe it's something more, like parties battling for guardianship.

Conor McAuley
France
Local time: 15:53
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 210
Grading comment
Thanks!

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Angus Stewart
51 mins
  -> Thanks Angus!

agree  philgoddard
1 hr
  -> Thanks Phil!

agree  AllegroTrans
2 hrs
  -> Thanks Chris!
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
repeated the same information


Explanation:
The appellant's lawyer maintained that the same information was true. The cause was retained to be judged that same day.

(FR: La cause était retenue à être jugé le même jour-là.)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 days 21 hrs (2021-10-25 16:20:16 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

La cause était une raison. L'avocat de l'appellant a constaté encore que c'était vrai la même conclusion.

(The cause was a reason. The information gave way to a conclusion.)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 days (2021-10-26 21:58:37 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Une conclusion est une décision basée sur le raisonnement. . C'est le fin de quelque chose, un arrangement final ou un accord, un règlement ou une solution. Quelque choise qui est concluant met le fin d'un doute. Enfiin c'est indicatif.
La conclusion d'un acte d'une pièce de théâtre indique le fin d'une partie d'une histoire.
En outre, chaque rédaction ou chaque essai devrait finir avec une conclusion dont les points pricipaux de l'écriture se refont dans un bref sommaire de la question.
Au thème de loi, cependdant, les conclusions peuvent être des faits qui se retrouvent dedans une investigation ou une enquête judiciaire. Si quelque chose d'une question judiciare manque en fait, ça reste sans conclusion. Ça veut dire que les faits concluants sont complèts, et les informations retrouvées vaulent pour aider à l'arrivée d'une résolution ou une décision. Enfin, avec ça et l'arrivée d'une conclusion, il n'y a pas d'espace pour rien d'autre, et comme ça un cas se finit, du moins transitoirement, sauf s'ils arrivent des autres faits retrouvés pour le refaire à continuation ...

Lisa Rosengard
United Kingdom
Local time: 14:53
Native speaker of: English

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  AllegroTrans: No, "conclusuions" as you have already learned from a previous question, has a very specific legal meaning, it's not "information". You are constantly ignoring CONTEXT and the language ACTUALLY USED in the law
1 hr
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Reference comments


1 hr peer agreement (net): +2
Reference: Conclusions (juridique)

Reference information:
This is about the French system, not the Swiss, but it gives a good idea of what conclusions are and how they're asserted in court.

"En procédure civile, devant un Tribunal judiciaire les avocats des parties sont amenées à remettre au juge un document qui contient l'exposé des moyens de fait ou de droit sur lesquels ils fondent les prétentions et les défenses de leurs clients. Ce document se dénomme des "conclusions" ...

Il arrive, qu'au fil des débats les conseils des parties modifient les prétentions de leurs clients et les moyens sur lesquels elles les fondent. Il est alors difficile de savoir si, à la clôture de l'instruction de l'affaire, elles ont ou non abandonné certaines de leurs premières demandes ou si elles ont abandonné une partie des moyens qui les fondaient initialement. Pour éviter toute incertitude, le décret du 28 décembre 1998 qui a modifié notamment l'art.753 du nouveau Code de procédure civile exige qu'à la fin de l'instruction de l'affaire les parties déposent des conclusions récapitulatives. Les demandes et les moyens qui n'y sont pas repris sont alors considérés comme ayant été "délaissées"...."
https://www.dictionnaire-juridique.com/definition/conclusion...

Eliza Hall
United States
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 145

Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
agree  AllegroTrans
50 mins
agree  Conor McAuley
10 hrs
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