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courant accostant/décostant

English translation: onshore/offshore

11:49 Jan 3, 2013
French to English translations [PRO]
Science - Ships, Sailing, Maritime / Sea
French term or phrase: courant accostant/décostant
The use of accostant/decostant comes up repeatedly in my text relating to shipping, and in particular port facilities, berthing, etc., but I can't find a translation anywhere. Used in such phrases as "courant accostant ou decostant inférieur a 0.6 noeuds"
Amy Grieve
Local time: 05:18
English translation:onshore/offshore
Explanation:
Very low confidence level, but based on a more common usage of "vent accostant", an onshore wind. might this fit the context?

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 41 mins (2013-01-03 12:30:49 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

As in "côte" for "coast" and "a/dé" for "on/off", thus "onshore/offshore".

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 44 mins (2013-01-03 12:34:05 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

http://www.ecy.wa.gov/programs/sea/swces/products/publicatio...

OFFSHORE CURRENTS: (1) Currents outside the SURF ZONE. (2) Any current flowing away from the SHORE. See Figure 7.

OFFSHORE WIND: A wind blowing seaward from the land in the coastal area.

ONSHORE: A direction landward from the SEA.

ONSHORE CURRENT: Any current flowing towards the SHORE.

ONSHORE WIND: A wind blowing landward from the SEA.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 48 mins (2013-01-03 12:38:24 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Onshore/offshore are used in VO texts in French in surfing, kitesurfing etc and are even to be found in erudite FR language doctoral sources :

http://tel.archives-ouvertes.fr/docs/00/32/11/80/PDF/These-C...

p124 : "Les directions du courant sont onshore sur le platier récifal et traduisent une entrée d’eau continue pour toutes les phases de marée. Ce courant onshore peut également être influencé par la brise de mer qui pousse les masses d’eau en direction de la côte, justifiant ainsi les vitesses plus élevées
enregistrées la journée. La nuit, avec une légère brise de terre, les courants conservent leur orientation onshore avec cependant une intensité plus faible."

p126 : "Ce courant offshore au niveau du platier récifal est également observé en marée de mortes-eaux (non illustrées ici), avec des renversements onshore à la moitié de la marée montante ainsi que pour l’étale de marée haute. Les vitesses du courant sur le platier récifal en mortes-eaux sont beaucoup plus
faibles, de l’ordre de 5 cm.s-1 en moyenne, avec des maximums enregistrés à 20 cm.s-1
."

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 50 mins (2013-01-03 12:40:07 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I used to surf and on the Quiberon coast, even 20 years ago, it was common to talk about "du onshore, du offshore" for wind and currents. If this reading fits your context, then I think you may have a possible solution for "accostant/décostant".

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 51 mins (2013-01-03 12:41:27 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

, given that "accoster" means to arrive from the sea and "décoster" to leave the coast/shore.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2013-01-03 14:03:08 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

When it comes to berthing manoeuvres, if you are are prepared to accept a link between "courant" and "vent accostant/décostant", as I have suggested throughout, then this may help : http://www.traitedemanoeuvre.fr/principes man quai_site.swf

Take a look in particular at the animations with the terms of reference.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2013-01-03 14:08:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

When it comes to berthing manoeuvres, if you are are prepared to accept a link between "courant" and "vent accostant/décostant", as I have suggested throughout, then this may help : http://www.traitedemanoeuvre.fr/principes man quai_site.swf

Take a look in particular at the animations with the terms of reference.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2013-01-03 14:19:00 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Guide des termes de marine, petit dictionnaire thématique de marine, Le Chasse-Marée/Ar Men, p90 :

"accoster : accoster à quai, c'est venir le long d'un quai ou d'un autre bateau; accoster la terre, c'est s'en rapprocher".

Adopting the second definition, accepting that its opposite may be "décoster", then "onshore/offshore" work. Accostant/décostant are not used commonly. In context, without further examples, or examples in more detailed situations, I see no other reading as possible.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2013-01-03 17:27:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

ON-BERTH/OFF-BERTH - vs - ONSHORE/OFFSHORE

There is no disagreement with the meaning of "accostant/décostant", to/from the shore. However, the choice of term is a little less clear.

On the one hand, the terms "on-berth/off-berth" exist (for wind and thus for currents). The only source I can track down for those terms is the one Australian one Michael refers too and it appears to be a perfectly sound reference. Further, also in favour of these terms is that they are apparently rare, with one or two hits on Google. That is also the case for "accostant/décostant", one or two with current and quite a few more for wind. If the rarity factor is of the essence, then it may be a good choice.

On the other hand, notwithstanding the rarity factor, in my experience, limited to a couple of years spent working in French/English department of a Luxembourg shipping mutual and over 20 years of translating maritime and nautical documents, in such contexts, "onshore" and "offshore" are totally standard terms when describing berthing manoeuvres. Whilst this can be an argument in favour of on/offshore, the opposite point of view can be justified. The fact that they are standard means they are perhaps not suitable for the terms posted.

There are arguments in support of both sets of terms. Target audience will come into it. I think it helpful for future reference that both sets of terms appear.
Selected response from:

Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Local time: 06:18
Grading comment
Thank you - this worked well for me :-)
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
3 +2on berth/off berth currents
Michael GREEN
3 +1current when docking / undocking
FoundInTrans
3rising and falling tidal currents
Jack Sims
2onshore/offshore
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Summary of reference entries provided
A bit of research ....
Michael GREEN

Discussion entries: 13





  

Answers


12 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
courant accostant/decostant
current when docking / undocking


Explanation:
I can't find an expression as exact as the French.


    Reference: http://www.linguee.fr/francais-anglais/search?source=auto&qu...
FoundInTrans
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:18
Native speaker of: English

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Michael GREEN: Although your suggestion might be capable of improvement, I think you have grasped the essential: we're talking about currents which intervene during docking - "positive or negative docking currents" (not a maritime term, AFAIK!).
43 mins
neutral  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: I agree this is a possible reading, but without more context, I have considered that another reading is possible. See post below.
46 mins
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18 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
courant accostant/decostant
rising and falling tidal currents


Explanation:
As the translation of accoster is to land or dock, by extrapolation, I suggest that there's a reference to tidal currents here (inward and outward, up and down, a and <a>de.
I'd need some more context to be 100%.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 20 mins (2013-01-03 12:09:41 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

*a and de

Jack Sims
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:18
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
courant accostant/decostant
on berth/off berth currents


Explanation:
See my reference posting below.

What applies to winds may also be applied to currents, IMHO.

Example sentence(s):
  • "...There are then 2 basic situations : On-Berth wind where the wind is pushing the craft towards the berth and the opposite Off-Berth wind..."

    Reference: http://marinewatchnsw.com/library/mooring.html
Michael GREEN
France
Local time: 06:18
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 56

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: Complies with my reading of this one but on/offshore are more common.//On/offshore are std terms for wind + currents when berthing + mooring, understood w/wide, not the case for on/off berth. ProZ reconfig for typing : time to drop the subject now.
24 mins
  -> But my dear Nikki, "shore" (on or off) is a general term, and here we are talking about berthing vessels in ports, so a more specific term is surely appropriate. Glad to see your typing has improved, BTW ;-)
agree  FoundInTrans: Sweet ~;-) It could equally mean that.
39 mins
  -> Thank you. We aim to please ...:-)
agree  Graham macLachlan: sounds good to me, sweetie ! LOL
2 hrs
  -> Hello sailor! Thank you for the "Agree" - as you are the most experienced bilingual matelot on Proz, I am grateful for your support ...
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39 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
courant accostant/decostant
onshore/offshore


Explanation:
Very low confidence level, but based on a more common usage of "vent accostant", an onshore wind. might this fit the context?

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 41 mins (2013-01-03 12:30:49 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

As in "côte" for "coast" and "a/dé" for "on/off", thus "onshore/offshore".

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 44 mins (2013-01-03 12:34:05 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

http://www.ecy.wa.gov/programs/sea/swces/products/publicatio...

OFFSHORE CURRENTS: (1) Currents outside the SURF ZONE. (2) Any current flowing away from the SHORE. See Figure 7.

OFFSHORE WIND: A wind blowing seaward from the land in the coastal area.

ONSHORE: A direction landward from the SEA.

ONSHORE CURRENT: Any current flowing towards the SHORE.

ONSHORE WIND: A wind blowing landward from the SEA.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 48 mins (2013-01-03 12:38:24 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Onshore/offshore are used in VO texts in French in surfing, kitesurfing etc and are even to be found in erudite FR language doctoral sources :

http://tel.archives-ouvertes.fr/docs/00/32/11/80/PDF/These-C...

p124 : "Les directions du courant sont onshore sur le platier récifal et traduisent une entrée d’eau continue pour toutes les phases de marée. Ce courant onshore peut également être influencé par la brise de mer qui pousse les masses d’eau en direction de la côte, justifiant ainsi les vitesses plus élevées
enregistrées la journée. La nuit, avec une légère brise de terre, les courants conservent leur orientation onshore avec cependant une intensité plus faible."

p126 : "Ce courant offshore au niveau du platier récifal est également observé en marée de mortes-eaux (non illustrées ici), avec des renversements onshore à la moitié de la marée montante ainsi que pour l’étale de marée haute. Les vitesses du courant sur le platier récifal en mortes-eaux sont beaucoup plus
faibles, de l’ordre de 5 cm.s-1 en moyenne, avec des maximums enregistrés à 20 cm.s-1
."

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 50 mins (2013-01-03 12:40:07 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I used to surf and on the Quiberon coast, even 20 years ago, it was common to talk about "du onshore, du offshore" for wind and currents. If this reading fits your context, then I think you may have a possible solution for "accostant/décostant".

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 51 mins (2013-01-03 12:41:27 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

, given that "accoster" means to arrive from the sea and "décoster" to leave the coast/shore.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2013-01-03 14:03:08 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

When it comes to berthing manoeuvres, if you are are prepared to accept a link between "courant" and "vent accostant/décostant", as I have suggested throughout, then this may help : http://www.traitedemanoeuvre.fr/principes man quai_site.swf

Take a look in particular at the animations with the terms of reference.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2013-01-03 14:08:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

When it comes to berthing manoeuvres, if you are are prepared to accept a link between "courant" and "vent accostant/décostant", as I have suggested throughout, then this may help : http://www.traitedemanoeuvre.fr/principes man quai_site.swf

Take a look in particular at the animations with the terms of reference.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2013-01-03 14:19:00 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Guide des termes de marine, petit dictionnaire thématique de marine, Le Chasse-Marée/Ar Men, p90 :

"accoster : accoster à quai, c'est venir le long d'un quai ou d'un autre bateau; accoster la terre, c'est s'en rapprocher".

Adopting the second definition, accepting that its opposite may be "décoster", then "onshore/offshore" work. Accostant/décostant are not used commonly. In context, without further examples, or examples in more detailed situations, I see no other reading as possible.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2013-01-03 17:27:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

ON-BERTH/OFF-BERTH - vs - ONSHORE/OFFSHORE

There is no disagreement with the meaning of "accostant/décostant", to/from the shore. However, the choice of term is a little less clear.

On the one hand, the terms "on-berth/off-berth" exist (for wind and thus for currents). The only source I can track down for those terms is the one Australian one Michael refers too and it appears to be a perfectly sound reference. Further, also in favour of these terms is that they are apparently rare, with one or two hits on Google. That is also the case for "accostant/décostant", one or two with current and quite a few more for wind. If the rarity factor is of the essence, then it may be a good choice.

On the other hand, notwithstanding the rarity factor, in my experience, limited to a couple of years spent working in French/English department of a Luxembourg shipping mutual and over 20 years of translating maritime and nautical documents, in such contexts, "onshore" and "offshore" are totally standard terms when describing berthing manoeuvres. Whilst this can be an argument in favour of on/offshore, the opposite point of view can be justified. The fact that they are standard means they are perhaps not suitable for the terms posted.

There are arguments in support of both sets of terms. Target audience will come into it. I think it helpful for future reference that both sets of terms appear.

Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Local time: 06:18
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 198
Grading comment
Thank you - this worked well for me :-)
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)




Reference comments


1 hr
Reference: A bit of research ....

Reference information:
Very few web hits, but the few I have found are all related to winds or currents which push the vessel to the quai/pontoon or away from it.

I think Asker might consider turning the phrase round a little, e.g. " currents tending to drive the vessel towards the berth or off it...".
Or simply, "on-berth or off-berth currents"?

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2013-01-03 13:20:58 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

A little more research comes up with "on-berth/off-berth wind":
"...There are then 2 basic situations : On-Berth wind where the wind is pushing the craft towards the berth and the opposite Off-Berth wind."

http://marinewatchnsw.com/library/mooring.html

I suggest that the same term can be applied to currents (which, as the article points out, are less often a problem when berthing except when combined with wind).

Example sentence(s):
  • " ....L'évitage continue, par un vent assez fort, parfois accostant, parfois décostant selon les sautes. Souvent le SAINT DENIS tire à pleine puissance pour écarter le cul du coin du quai....

    Reference: http://bit.ly/Wg9T7f
    Reference: http://www.passengerships.fr/1/category/ferries/3.html
Michael GREEN
France
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 56
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)



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