Pages in topic:   < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27] >
Off topic: 对人生与社会的思考
Thread poster: chance (X)
jyuan_us
jyuan_us  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 07:44
Member (2005)
English to Chinese
+ ...
沒必要啦 Mar 24, 2008

chance wrote:

多谢指出,以后我改用全称:法国国际广播中文台。

jyuan_us wrote:

我的意思是不看你的内容,也不知到你是发过来的,很难把法广理解为法国广播公司,还以为是O功什么的办的电台呢。


反正看你的帖子的人都不如我愚鈍﹐他們都不會誤解。不要麻煩啦。


 
wherestip
wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 06:44
Chinese to English
+ ...
Sainthood Mar 25, 2008

Angus Woo wrote:

The so called reincarnation in fact is just a man-made system ...



Angus,

Indeed. Not to be in any way sacrilegious, but In my opinion it's better to idolize the dead than to idolize the living.

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1606225,00.html



The crowds who still chant John Paul's name in St. Peter's Square, and the countless individuals praying to his soul, are counting on him reaching those two respective thresholds faster than either Mother Teresa or Escriva. Polish President Lech Kaczynski said Monday that he understood from an oblique response from Vatican Secretary of State Tarcisio Bertone that John Paul would be made a saint by 2010. A more credible hint that the wait will be relatively short was Benedict's declaration Monday that "in the communion of saints, it seems we can hear the living voice of our beloved John Paul II, who from the house of his father, we are sure, continues to accompany the Church." In other words, for the current Pope, John Paul is already among the chosen few.

...

Still, canonization causes do often begin with popular movements, and are brought forth from the diocesan level of the Church hierarchy to the Holy See for consideration. John Paul's cause is being presented by the dioceses of both Rome and Krakow, where he was Archbishop. This week they presented mounds of evidence of his virtues, and at least one miracle said to be credited to his intercession, to the Congregation for the Causes of Saints. Officials will study the case of Sister Marie Simon-Pierre, a 46-year-old French nun diagnosed with Parkinson's Disease — the same illness that afflicted the late Pope — that inexplicably disappeared two months after John Paul had died. The typical procedure to verify a person's saintliness includes the equivalent of a trial, which includes a lawyer arguing against the cause (who gave name to the expression the "Devil's Advocate"), and doctors testifying to the proof that purported miracles have no scientific explanation. A post-mortem miracle must be verified to reach beatification, and a second for canonization.



 
Angus Woo
Angus Woo
Local time: 19:44
Chinese to English
+ ...
Dead ones are perfect Mar 25, 2008

wherestip wrote:

Angus,

Indeed. Not to be in any way sacrilegious, but In my opinion it's better to idolize the dead than to idolize the living.

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1606225,00.html



The crowds who still chant John Paul's name in St. Peter's Square, and the countless individuals praying to his soul, are counting on him reaching those two respective thresholds faster than either Mother Teresa or Escriva. Polish President Lech Kaczynski said Monday that he understood from an oblique response from Vatican Secretary of State Tarcisio Bertone that John Paul would be made a saint by 2010. A more credible hint that the wait will be relatively short was Benedict's declaration Monday that "in the communion of saints, it seems we can hear the living voice of our beloved John Paul II, who from the house of his father, we are sure, continues to accompany the Church." In other words, for the current Pope, John Paul is already among the chosen few.

...

Still, canonization causes do often begin with popular movements, and are brought forth from the diocesan level of the Church hierarchy to the Holy See for consideration. John Paul's cause is being presented by the dioceses of both Rome and Krakow, where he was Archbishop. This week they presented mounds of evidence of his virtues, and at least one miracle said to be credited to his intercession, to the Congregation for the Causes of Saints. Officials will study the case of Sister Marie Simon-Pierre, a 46-year-old French nun diagnosed with Parkinson's Disease — the same illness that afflicted the late Pope — that inexplicably disappeared two months after John Paul had died. The typical procedure to verify a person's saintliness includes the equivalent of a trial, which includes a lawyer arguing against the cause (who gave name to the expression the "Devil's Advocate"), and doctors testifying to the proof that purported miracles have no scientific explanation. A post-mortem miracle must be verified to reach beatification, and a second for canonization.




Perfect tense? yup, that's why it's called perfect.


 
chica nueva
chica nueva
Local time: 23:44
Chinese to English
Genghis Khan, the Yellow Emperor Mar 25, 2008

wherestip wrote:

Angus Woo wrote:

The so called reincarnation in fact is just a man-made system ...



Angus,

Indeed. Not to be in any way sacrilegious, but In my opinion it's better to idolize the dead than to idolize the living.

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1606225,00.html


Hi Steve

Did you know that the Mongolians venerate Genghis Khan?

http://news.xinhuanet.com/st/2006-01/20/content_4075366.htm
守护成陵世代相传 成吉思汗圣灯780年从未熄灭

and did you know about the Yellow Emperor Park, near Zhengzhou?
http://www.66china.com.cn/n49622c479.aspx
黄帝故里-郑州旅游景点


[Edited at 2008-03-25 21:31]

[Edited at 2008-03-25 22:49]


 
chance (X)
chance (X)
French to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
与时共进 Mar 27, 2008

与时共进

事物都是发展的,没有一成不变的原则。如果没有八十年代的经济改革,也不会有今天中国的经济繁荣。

西藏解放57年,至今没有形成安定和谐的局面,如果不说是西藏政策的全面失败,至少可以检讨失误。一个伟大的党应该是能够自我反省和自我批评的。一个政府的宗旨应该是给人民创造一个安定与和谐的生活环境,所以我相信政府在冷静后,还是要考虑对话,而且不会拖太长时间,最多几个月后便会开始对话。

[Edited at 2008-03-27 06:59]


 
chance (X)
chance (X)
French to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
大陆舆论谈台湾民主政治的成熟 Mar 27, 2008

http://telechargement.rfi.fr.edgesuite.net/rfi/chinois/audio/modules/actu/R099/chropekin240308jour.mp3.asx

 
chance (X)
chance (X)
French to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
西藏民族冲突的反思 Mar 27, 2008

部分摘录:

人类不是单一的种族,谁都热爱自己家乡的土地。不错,任何一个国家不会容忍暴徒,但跑到别人家里喧宾夺主,在哪一个国家也一定招人怨恨。中国政府赶走藏人的精神领袖、再以减免税的手段奖励汉人去西藏从商的政策和汉人在别人的土地上耀武扬威、不顾主人感受的行径难道不要反思么。

全文不长:
http://www.rfi.fr/actucn/articles/099/article_6523.asp


 
lbone
lbone  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 19:44
Member (2006)
English to Chinese
+ ...
精神领袖的历史 Mar 27, 2008

chance wrote:

部分摘录:

人类不是单一的种族,谁都热爱自己家乡的土地。不错,任何一个国家不会容忍暴徒,但跑到别人家里喧宾夺主,在哪一个国家也一定招人怨恨。中国政府赶走藏人的精神领袖、再以减免税的手段奖励汉人去西藏从商的政策和汉人在别人的土地上耀武扬威、不顾主人感受的行径难道不要反思么。

全文不长:
http://www.rfi.fr/actucn/articles/099/article_6523.asp


从这里的讨论,可以看出不仅大陆的人士有“偏见”,西方“自由世界”的人士的知识也有“偏见”和“局限性”,都容易受媒体的误导。只是在自己的环境下呆多了,不自知而已。

西藏的“精神领袖”,历史上最多时有上百个,他们相互争斗,抢夺对藏民的主导权。清朝的时候,当时的清皇朝从这上百个“精神领袖”中扶植出达赖和班禅两支,这种局面延续至今。

达赖和班禅的"领袖地位",本来就是中央政府扶植出来的。

另外,以前西藏中还有农奴制。不知奴隶主算不算需要尊重的精神领袖。有一首流行的歌曲“阿姐鼓”,不知有多少人了解它的背景,阿姐鼓是生杀少女,用少女的皮肤制成的鼓。

[Edited at 2008-03-27 09:04]


 
chance (X)
chance (X)
French to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
在我贴出“西藏民族冲突的反思”文章后 Mar 27, 2008

有网友发来了这个链接,另类观点,我把它贴在这里,供感兴趣者阅读,文章不算太长。

特别说明一下,我贴文章链接并不一定是代表我的看法,一般是我认为值得考虑的一个方面或一种观点。

我个人比较明确的想法,在“与时共进”那贴里谈了, 现在的关键是要一起向前看,反思和反省是为了推动事物向好的方向发展,要开始新的对话,才有可能展望未
... See more
有网友发来了这个链接,另类观点,我把它贴在这里,供感兴趣者阅读,文章不算太长。

特别说明一下,我贴文章链接并不一定是代表我的看法,一般是我认为值得考虑的一个方面或一种观点。

我个人比较明确的想法,在“与时共进”那贴里谈了, 现在的关键是要一起向前看,反思和反省是为了推动事物向好的方向发展,要开始新的对话,才有可能展望未来。

亚洲时报:西藏动乱的“罗生门”
http://mysecrecy.com/index.php?hl=f5&q=uggc://jjj.qjarjf.pbz/to/ZnvaArjf/Bcvavba/2008_3_26_3_58_30_638.ugzy

[Edited at 2008-03-27 09:14]
Collapse


 
chance (X)
chance (X)
French to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
达赖不要求西藏独立,他谈的是文化自治 Mar 27, 2008

根据3月19日一篇采访文章,法国外长指出:达赖不要求西藏独立,他谈的是文化自治。

http://www.ambafrance-cn.org/spip.php?article4312&lang=fr


[Edited at 2008-03-27 09:51]


 
Wenjer Leuschel (X)
Wenjer Leuschel (X)  Identity Verified
Taiwan
Local time: 19:44
English to Chinese
+ ...
No Justification Mar 27, 2008

lbone wrote:

从这里的讨论,可以看出不仅大陆的人士有“偏见”,西方“自由世界”的人士的知识也有“偏见”和“局限性”,都容易受媒体的误导。只是在自己的环境下呆多了,不自知而已。

西藏的“精神领袖”,历史上最多时有上百个,他们相互争斗,抢夺对藏民的主导权。清朝的时候,当时的清皇朝从这上百个“精神领袖”中扶植出达赖和班禅两支,这种局面延续至今。

达赖和班禅的"领袖地位",本来就是中央政府扶植出来的。

另外,以前西藏中还有农奴制。不知奴隶主算不算需要尊重的精神领袖。有一首流行的歌曲“阿姐鼓”,不知有多少人了解它的背景,阿姐鼓是生杀少女,用少女的皮肤制成的鼓。


As I stressed before, the point is: We can never take the past wrongdoings of others to justify our present wrongdoings.


[Edited at 2008-03-27 11:14]


 
chica nueva
chica nueva
Local time: 23:44
Chinese to English
人皮鼓 - 甘肃桥湾城的故事 Mar 27, 2008

lbone wrote:
另外,以前西藏中还有农奴制。不知奴隶主算不算需要尊重的精神领袖。有一首流行的歌曲“阿姐鼓”,不知有多少人了解它的背景,阿姐鼓是生杀少女,用少女的皮肤制成的鼓。

[Edited at 2008-03-27 09:04]


桥湾城

安息县城东面六十公里的地方,在公路的北面,可以清楚的看到一座古城遗址,系清代建筑.城呈长方形,东西长约三百米,南北宽一百米,黄土版筑.这就是传说故事"康熙也盟桥湾"里的桥湾古城遗址.相传在公元十七世纪,清朝的康熙皇帝又一天晚上作了一个梦,梦见在茫茫荒漠之中,有一绿洲,景色明净宜人.在高耸入云的银山下,在一片金洼之中有一座高大的城池,一条弯弯曲曲的小河由东向西流着,城头旌旗招展,城中金碧辉煌.在一棵参天大树上,挂着一顶金光耀眼的皇冠,下面还有蟒袍玉带.第二天清晨,康熙皇帝梦醒了以后,觉得这个地方必定是龙游圣地,于是他让臣下依照梦中情景绘成图后,派人四处查访,结果找到了甘肃安息的桥湾镇,那里沙平水静,南面有银山(祁连山),又有滔滔麦浪,象一偏近洼.恰有一条小河从东向西蜿蜒流去,河谷之中,有一棵大树,正巧树上挂有一顶草帽和鹊雀窝相衬,远远望去,好象一顶皇冠.一切景象,竟完全和梦中一样.康熙知道后非常高兴,立刻拨了一笔巨款,令一位大臣亲赴桥湾修一坐像紫禁城一样的城池.

这伟大晨风明带了他的大儿子来到了安息桥湾镇,他俩见财起意,认为这里据京城遥遥万里,老佛爷哪能跑到这个地方来游览呢,于是私吞了大量金银,修了不到一里见方的既矮且小的城池,回京交了差.不料,一年之后有一位钦差大臣奉命被派到西北来办事,路过桥湾顺路看了这座钦命修建的城池,发现这个大臣贪污巨款,欺君犯上,便上奏康熙,处死了大臣夫子,并从他们的脊背上剥下一整块人皮,做了一大一小两个人皮鼓,挂在桥湾镇的一座庙里,作为维护皇威,惩罚贪官的警戒.

相传,在那飞沙走石,狂风四起的时候,这两个人皮鼓往往不敲自鸣,响声卜卜,如人的哀鸣.

据地方志记载:桥湾城实际上是康熙的儿子用正在位时所建.

段德义,齐宝玲,理映瑞 编,"甘肃旅游指南",中国旅游出版社,北京,1982


 
chance (X)
chance (X)
French to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
我觉得有几个比较容易误解的地方需要说明一下 Mar 27, 2008

如果批评中国政府的一些做法,并不等于批评所有中国人,希望能够把对政府的批评,与否定中国、否定中国人民这种想法区别开来。这点我们在外面呆得时间较长的人可以很自然地做到。例如:嘲笑我们总统英语太差的录像,我也觉得好笑,一方面这是事实;二来尽管是嘲笑法国总统,一般法国人也不会认为是嘲笑所有法国人或是嘲笑整个法国;第三点,我认为这是一个并�... See more
如果批评中国政府的一些做法,并不等于批评所有中国人,希望能够把对政府的批评,与否定中国、否定中国人民这种想法区别开来。这点我们在外面呆得时间较长的人可以很自然地做到。例如:嘲笑我们总统英语太差的录像,我也觉得好笑,一方面这是事实;二来尽管是嘲笑法国总统,一般法国人也不会认为是嘲笑所有法国人或是嘲笑整个法国;第三点,我认为这是一个并非恶意的玩笑,所以也不会那么紧张,更不会计较。

顺便说明一下,由于我们现任总统的特性,法国媒体如果不是每天都有嘲笑批评他的文章,也是隔三差五就有,今天我还读到很正规的法国报纸评论他正在进行的英国访问,最后还开了他一句玩笑。这在国内看来是不可理解的事情,在我们这里已司空见惯,总统的形象并不会因此而受到太多影响,我们已经知道区分严肃的批评与幽默的区别,当然幽默也是一种批评形式。

我们指出国内宣传有严格的控制,这是一个事实,但并不表明国外的媒体就没有失误或片面的地方。此外,尽管国内媒体受到严格控制,也不等于所有国内人都不能得到较为全面的信息,有很多其它方法可以获得较为全面的信息。当然,如果仅以国内报纸、电台或电视台为获取信息的渠道,在有些受控制的问题上是不能得到较为完整的信息的。

如果我们贴一些文章,一般是认为有一定参考价值,并不一定就代表个人观点。我个人喜欢专门写清个人观点部分,有时也可能是正在思考并不成熟的观点。
Collapse


 
lbone
lbone  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 19:44
Member (2006)
English to Chinese
+ ...
两件事 Mar 27, 2008

Wenjer Leuschel wrote:

lbone wrote:

从这里的讨论,可以看出不仅大陆的人士有“偏见”,西方“自由世界”的人士的知识也有“偏见”和“局限性”,都容易受媒体的误导。只是在自己的环境下呆多了,不自知而已。

西藏的“精神领袖”,历史上最多时有上百个,他们相互争斗,抢夺对藏民的主导权。清朝的时候,当时的清皇朝从这上百个“精神领袖”中扶植出达赖和班禅两支,这种局面延续至今。

达赖和班禅的"领袖地位",本来就是中央政府扶植出来的。

另外,以前西藏中还有农奴制。不知奴隶主算不算需要尊重的精神领袖。有一首流行的歌曲“阿姐鼓”,不知有多少人了解它的背景,阿姐鼓是生杀少女,用少女的皮肤制成的鼓。


As I stressed before, the point is: We can never take the past wrongdoings to justify our present wrongdoings.


你说的没错,这件事,媒体不让进入,这说明过程中存在一些见不得光的东西。

不过我写的这段,本来就是针对我引用的下面这段内容,这段中关于精神领袖、关于西藏传统、关于别人/主人、关于所谓别人的土地,这些本身是站不住脚的。

Chance wrote:

人类不是单一的种族,谁都热爱自己家乡的土地。不错,任何一个国家不会容忍暴徒,但跑到别人家里喧宾夺主,在哪一个国家也一定招人怨恨。中国政府赶走藏人的精神领袖、再以减免税的手段奖励汉人去西藏从商的政策 和汉人在别人的土地上耀武扬威、不顾主人感受的行径难道不要反思么。


达赖对于藏人而言本来就是外来文化。

达赖(相当于观音)从宗教地位看,低于班禅(相当于无量),只是政治地位高于班禅。达赖与班禅,是佛教传入后,在约五百年以内出现的政教人物,而且是中央政府从上百个“精神领袖”中选择扶植出来的,并不是藏人自古以来的文化传承。所以达赖和宗教团体的要求,本身谈不上什么主人的要求。他们只能代表少数宗教团体自己。而且达赖也代表不了班禅一系。

达赖出现以来,好些代达赖都短寿,很多不到20就挂了,他们的短寿说白了是政治角逐中被他们自己的摄政权臣给害了。现在这一代达赖是所有14代中活得最长的的位。从这一点看,关于达赖的问题,无论在他们内部,还是在和中央、国家的关系上,始终是政治问题,不是什么本宗信仰和外来干涉的问题,宗教只是一层外衣而已。从达赖的最初册封和转世流程的定制过程看,这一直是中国以内的一个子系统,属于一种政治妥协,而且这种妥协只是利益团体之间的妥协,藏人民众本身的利益也未必被考虑在内(清朝已经是封建社会了,但西藏的农权制直到PRC建国后才废除),更谈不上什么国与国之间问题。

如果要关心,应该关心民众的利益,而不是关心这样一个政治人物和他的小团体的利益。


 
chance (X)
chance (X)
French to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Ibon, Mar 27, 2008

你谈的其它问题我了解不多,所以不反对这种观点。

我的问题是,如果你的论点成立,应该由谁代表大多数藏民的利益来与政府谈判,以便化解积蓄已久的矛盾?

纯粹探讨,并无它意。
lbone wrote:

如果要关心,应该关心民众的利益,而不是关心这样一个政治人物和他的小团体的利益。


[Edited at 2008-03-27 12:39]


 
Pages in topic:   < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27] >


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:


You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

对人生与社会的思考






Trados Studio 2022 Freelance
The leading translation software used by over 270,000 translators.

Designed with your feedback in mind, Trados Studio 2022 delivers an unrivalled, powerful desktop and cloud solution, empowering you to work in the most efficient and cost-effective way.

More info »
Protemos translation business management system
Create your account in minutes, and start working! 3-month trial for agencies, and free for freelancers!

The system lets you keep client/vendor database, with contacts and rates, manage projects and assign jobs to vendors, issue invoices, track payments, store and manage project files, generate business reports on turnover profit per client/manager etc.

More info »