Mar 27, 2013 14:04
11 yrs ago
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English term

no order as to costs save for detailed assessment of the applicant's costs

English to Slovak Law/Patents Law (general) Final court order
"no order as to costs save for detailed assessment of the applicant's costs"

I would translate this as:
"Navrhovateľ uhradí vlastné, detailne stanovené finančné náklady, vyplývajúce zo súdneho konania".

Avšak mohlo by toto taktiež znamenať, že finančné náklady navrhovateľa budú financované cez bezplatnú právnu pomoc (legal aid), ak sú, podľa nariadenia, jeho náklady na preklad záverečného súdneho nariadenia financované cez bezplatnú právnu pomoc?

Discussion

Slavomir BELIS Apr 10, 2013:
Poznámka k - assessment. Dôležitejšie je to, čo je napísané. Nie to všetko, čo sa za tým skrýva. A - assessment - nie je podľa môjho názoru vyčíslenie ani rozpis nákladov ani nič také. Je to práveže posúdenie/zhodnotenie tých rozpísaných nákladov. Čiže ja by som sa držal toho "podrobné zhodnotenie (skôr posúdenie) nákladov navrhovateľa" - lebo to je v tom napísané. A toto to vysvetľuje "An officer of the court, Costs Judge or District Judge will then assess the reasonableness of the costs..."
Rad Graban (X) Mar 28, 2013:
Príkaz v. rozkaz Ja by som sa pri "costs/trovách/nákladoch prikláňal skôr k "príkazu". Keby išlo o nejakú škodu, stratu atď., vtedy by som použil "rozkaz".
Hi guys, in my Slovak mind there is really not much difference between "podrobne zhodnotenie nakladov" and "podrobne vycislenie nakladov". :-) It is true however, that expression "trovy" is still often used in legal context - and today perhaps only in there because in all other contexts (which come into my mind) it would sound quite obsolete.
zola77 (X) (asker) Mar 27, 2013:
Rad, I agree.
Rad Graban (X) Mar 27, 2013:
@Asker I really don't think that 'assessment' here means 'zhodnotenie'/'posúdenie'/'vyhodnotenie'....... In my opinion it means a detailed breakdown of all costs (podrobné vyčíslenie trov). Google "detailed assessment".
zola77 (X) (asker) Mar 27, 2013:
"Súdne nariadenie vo veci náhrady trov súdneho konania nie je vydané, avšak nariaďuje sa podrobné zhodnotenie nákladov navrhovateľa" Looking at your fantastic suggestions, this is what makes most sense to me?

It is really not up to me to investigate whether the applicant is to pay the cost, it is not clear from the sentence (which doesn't even sound like a sentence, and does sound out of context), so you are right to keep it simple and as close to the meaning as possible. I tried to translate it more freely and it backfired! :) Thank you very much for help!!
Stuart Hoskins Mar 27, 2013:
no order as to costs "each Party bears their own costs in relation to the part of the proceedings to which the Order relates regardless of the final costs Order made at the conclusion of the proceedings"
http://www.veritas.co.uk/Articles/Articles_Entitlement.aspx
Rad Graban (X) Mar 27, 2013:
@Asker I believe that 'save for detailed assessment of the applicant's costs' should be translated as 'okrem náhrady (podrobných) trov konania navrhovateľa'. I'm not sure what could be the costs in 'no order as to costs'.
http://dispute.practicallaw.com/5-204-8012
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web...
Stuart Hoskins Mar 27, 2013:
I'm no lawyer so I'm afraid don't know. They overhauled the legal aid system several years back to make qualifying more stringent. As far as I am aware, a party resident outside the EU (even if a British citizen and the respondent) wouldn't qualify for legal aid in England, but within the EU? Charter of Fundamental Rights? Sorry.
zola77 (X) (asker) Mar 27, 2013:
Stuart, what confuses me is that in this particular statement, the word "publicly" is not mentioned. Both the applicant and the respondent are slovakian, but applicant lives in Slovakia and respondent lives in England. Would the applicant be still entitled to get Legal Aid?
Stuart Hoskins Mar 27, 2013:
That's how I would understand it, zola77.
Dakujem Zola, no myslim, ze to kludne mozete aj tak ponechat v tvare, ktory som navrhol, lebo ten bod nehovori nic menej ani nic viac. Tak ako tento bod chapem ja, sud nerozhodol o ziadnych nakladoch pre navrhovatela (ani pre obzalovaneho, ak sa tieto nespominaju v predchadzajucich bodoch), iba podrobne zhodnoti (alebo zhodnotil) naklady navrhovatela.
zola77 (X) (asker) Mar 27, 2013:
Juraj, uviedla som celu vetu. Jedna sa o sudne nariadenie Najvyssieho sudu, toto je posledny z bodov.
zola77 (X) (asker) Mar 27, 2013:
Stuart, does this mean that the applicant won't be required to pay the cost as this will be covered by legal aid, yet the assessment will be carried out to define the cost? Just checking I got it right!

Proposed translations

+1
27 mins
Selected

žiaden rozkaz vo veci nákladov okrem podrobného zhodnotenia nákladov navrhovateľa

Bohužiaľ ste neuviedli celú vetu, preto prekladám čo najpresnejšie len Vaše zadanie "no order as to costs save for detailed assessment of the applicant's costs". Nerád by som špekuloval nad inou interpretáciou, lebo nepoznáme šírší kontext a táto interpretácia je najprsnejšia

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Note added at 166 days (2013-09-10 07:48:09 GMT) Post-grading
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Dakujem Zola
Peer comment(s):

agree Vladimír Hoffman : Hm, nemal by súd vydať skôr príkaz? Mimochodom, tá najprsnejšia interpretácia sa mi páči:-)))
1 hr
Dakujem Vlado, kontroloval som to aj v pravnych textoch na webe a vo financnych veciach sud naozaj vydava platobny rozkaz
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
4 hrs

žiadny príkaz na náhradu trov súdneho konania okrem náhrady podrobne vyčíslených trov...

vzniknutých navrhovateľovi.
Môj návrh po Stewartovom príspevku v diskusii. To "žiadny príkaz" sa asi dá preložiť aj inak/krajsie, záleží na vete, ktorá tým bodom predchadza.
Peer comment(s):

neutral Juro Sebestyen, A.B.I.E.S. s.r.o. : Ale problem je prave v tom Rad, ze o nahrade trov sa v zadani nehovori. Zadanie hovori len o ich podrobnom zhodnoteni, alebo ako si uviedol Ty v diskusii, o ich "podrobnom vycisleni". Okrem toho vo veci platieb vydáva platobný "rozkaz", nie "príkaz"
10 hrs
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13 days

súdne nariadenie neobsahuje žiadne rozhodnutie o súdnych trovách, ale nariaďuje podrobné posúdenie

nákladov navrhovateľa

ešte raz vcelku

(Toto) Súdne nariadenie neobsahuje žiadne rozhodnutie o súdnych trovách, ale nariaďuje podrobné posúdenie nákladov navrhovateľa.

alebo možno

Súčasťou tohto súdneho nariadenia nie je žiadne rozhodnutie o súdnych trovách, ale nariaďuje podrobné posúdenie nákladov navrhovateľa.

Ako sama naznačujete v diskusii, táto anglická veta nevyjadruje nič o tom, kto má alebo nemá platiť, respektíve koľko by mal platiť alebo ako - lebo to všetko asi bude zhodnotené neskôr, keď budú posúdené náklady.
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Reference comments

27 mins
Reference:

No order as to costs save for a detailed assessment of the wife's publicy funded costs.

"This means that there is no order for costs to be recovered from the other side but the court is making an order that there be a detailed assessment carried out by the court if this is applicable.

A detailed assessment is where the solicitor prepares, unsurprisingly, a detailed bill of costs showing all work that has been carried out under the terms of the public funding certificate."
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3 hrs
Reference:

Detailed assesment

Detailed assessment

For more complex cases a process, formerly called a taxation of costs, now known as detailed assessment, is used. It is unrelated to "tax" in the sense of a method of raising government revenue. The successful party must file with the court a detailed breakdown of the costs and disbursements incurred, known as a bill of costs which sets out the successful party's claim. The bill is usually prepared by a law costs draftsman, whose skill is often as essential to successful litigation as that of a solicitor or barrister. An officer of the court, Costs Judge or District Judge will then assess the reasonableness of the costs with reference to a statutory schedule of limits of entitlements of costs, together with legal precedents, unless the costs can be agreed between the parties. The level of reduction can mean that the bill is reduced in some instances substantially, but in most cases at least 80% of the costs originally sought will be allowed. A court order for costs is enforceable as a debt against the unsuccessful party.[14]

Either party can appeal against a detailed assessment, to a Costs Judge or District Judge of the High Court if the assessment was made by a court officer, or by the usual routes of appeal if the assessment was made by a judge.
Peer comments on this reference comment:

agree Charles Stanford : Looks about right then
1 day 3 hrs
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