| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Ever lost a project due to your principles? Thread poster: Lingua 5B
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Lingua 5B 
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 11:28
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
I just got a situation. There's this one agency that had been calling me on the phone for every little project. The agency is based in the UK. All their numerous PMs (there are hundreds) speak very poor English but enjoy always arranging projects on the phone for some reason.
And here it comes again today. PM No.1 phones me, introduces herself, and offers a tiny project. Me: I cannot take on any projects under €50. She says: fine, fine, let me check. OK, we can pay €50 (the proj... See more I just got a situation. There's this one agency that had been calling me on the phone for every little project. The agency is based in the UK. All their numerous PMs (there are hundreds) speak very poor English but enjoy always arranging projects on the phone for some reason.
And here it comes again today. PM No.1 phones me, introduces herself, and offers a tiny project. Me: I cannot take on any projects under €50. She says: fine, fine, let me check. OK, we can pay €50 (the project was probably worth something like €20). Her English was so bad that she couldn't even explain to me it was a proofreading, not translation project. I say OK, but make it quick, send materials ASAP, because I need to manage my time.
One and a half hour through, I get a message from a PM No. 2, in their automatic system "accept" or "decline" only to realize it's a proofreading project and they set it to to something like 26 GBP.
I just dropped it. I had the time to do this, but I didn't. Coordination between PM 1 and PM 2 was poor, they tried to trick me into accepting the low rate, etc. They wasted my 1,5 hr waiting for their email, etc.
Note: I sent messages before to their 10-20 different PMs explaining my minimum rate for them. But despite all this, they keep coming back with their poor English and small projects.
Note: what I was offered today was an easy project, I could have done it in one hour or less maybe, not sure. What would you have done? ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Why are you asking... | Sep 19, 2016 |
Why are you asking instead of just dropping them?
I mean, judging by what you wrote, and how you wrote it, it sounds as if that's what you want to do yourself in the first place, so it's hard to imagine why you're still bothering with them...
BTW, how is this a matter of principle, instead of an agency wasting your time "with their poor English and small projects"?
[Edited at 2016-09-19 14:11 GMT]
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 11:28
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Mirko Mainardi wrote:
Why are you asking instead of just dropping them?
I mean, judging by what you wrote, and how you wrote it, it sounds as if that's what you want to do yourself in the first place, so it's hard to imagine why you're still bothering with them...
BTW, how is this a matter of principles, instead of an agency wasting your time "with their poor English and small projects"?
I did a couple of big projects for them and would do again. I would ignore the bad English if they respected my minimum budget requirement.
Yes, but so far they sent like 20+ small project requests, if I find them super simple I would perhaps accept one at €30. Perhaps some would think 20 projects x 20 euros, that's something? I don't know, different people diff. approach, just want to hear opinions?
They were OK, even a great agency at the beginning, then just overnight starting insisting on small projects. I am staying as it makes business sense potentially waiting for a project counted in thousands?
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:28
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Mirko Mainardi wrote:
Why are you asking instead of just dropping them?
I mean, judging by what you wrote, and how you wrote it, it sounds as if that's what you want to do yourself in the first place, so it's hard to imagine why you're still bothering with them...
BTW, how is this a matter of principle, instead of an agency wasting your time "with their poor English and small projects"?
[Edited at 2016-09-19 14:11 GMT]
And speaking of poor English....
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Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 11:28
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Another problem | Sep 19, 2016 |
.. is that we cannot report chaotic project management anywhere. I am not talking about Blue Board, but perhaps somewhere else on ProZ. How can someone manage an agency like that and still get away with it?
I mean is it even legal to employ 100 interns from different countries who can hardly speak English and have no clue what they are doing, and then replace them every month with 100 new ones?
[Edited at 2016-09-19 14:31 GMT]
| | | | | What about it? | Sep 19, 2016 |
Tom in London wrote: Mirko Mainardi wrote:
Why are you asking instead of just dropping them?
I mean, judging by what you wrote, and how you wrote it, it sounds as if that's what you want to do yourself in the first place, so it's hard to imagine why you're still bothering with them...
BTW, how is this a matter of principle, instead of an agency wasting your time "with their poor English and small projects"?
[Edited at 2016-09-19 14:11 GMT] And speaking of poor English....
What about it? You have my full attention.
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Lingua 5B wrote:
I did a couple of big projects for them and would do again. I would ignore the bad English if they respected my minimum budget requirement.
Yes, but so far they sent like 20+ small project requests, if I find them super simple I would perhaps accept one at €30. Perhaps some would think 20 projects x 20 euros, that's something? I don't know, different people diff. approach, just want to hear opinions?
They were OK, even a great agency at the beginning, then just overnight starting insisting on small projects. I am staying as it makes business sense potentially waiting for a project counted in thousands?
Well, after reading your first post I got the impression you considered this agency a total waste of time (because of the tiny projects and communication issues), that's why I asked... But if you also worked on big projects for them, then I can understand why you're not dropping them altogether.
I guess asking them to at least switch to email isn't an option either? That way you would at least (hopefully) lessen the communication issues and have written proof of your dealings/agreements with their PMs... Perhaps you could bring this up with a vendor manager...
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 11:28
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | This is probably the key point. | Sep 19, 2016 |
[quote]Mirko Mainardi wrote:
Lingua 5B wrote:
I guess asking them to at least switch to email isn't an option either? That way you would at least (hopefully) lessen the communication issues and have written proof of your dealings/agreements with their PMs... Perhaps you could bring this up with a vendor manager...
I am going to try this one, but they didn't seem to read or listen to my suggestions before.
Perhaps I was tricked with a few big projects at the beginning, perhaps they do this to everyone? Now I keep thinking some other good projects will come up but they never will? As I said, perhaps many small projects would make sense to someone else, I don't know.
Also they are probably using the phone call to grab translator's attention quicker. All fair, but why not using someone who is actually capable of speaking on the phone then?
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Sheila Wilson
Spain
Local time: 10:28
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
| Does it actually make sense though? | Sep 19, 2016 |
Lingua 5B wrote:
They were OK, even a great agency at the beginning, then just overnight starting insisting on small projects. I am staying as it makes business sense potentially waiting for a project counted in thousands?
With so many small jobs, the big job only hoped for - not promised - and so many communications problems, does it really make sense? Have you actually calculated how much per hour on average you're making from this client? Tot up every minute of your time spent on them over a month - not just translating/editing but on phone calls, emails, waiting around for possible work, filling in forms, etc, etc. And then see how much they've paid you per hour of that time. For all your principles, I suspect you may actually find you've been working for peanuts. Add to that the very great likelihood of an enormous mess and consequent non-payment due to the poor communication. Is it really worth it? Do they even pay promptly?
I have a client who sends very many small jobs, and some of them really are tiny. However, the (French) communication has been slimmed right down to:
Client: Hello, Can you edit this for 2pm tomorrow?
Me: Fine.
. . . . .
Me: Here's your revised text
Client: Thanks
As the admin involves simply creating one line in my spreadsheet and copying that line into the monthly invoice, the actual hourly rate is fine. Also, the invoice is always paid within a week or two. I fear it would be a very different matter with this client you're currently dealing with.
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:28
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Mirko Mainardi wrote:
What about it? You have my full attention.
See the OP
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 11:28
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Prompt payers. | Sep 19, 2016 |
Sheila Wilson wrote: Lingua 5B wrote:
They were OK, even a great agency at the beginning, then just overnight starting insisting on small projects. I am staying as it makes business sense potentially waiting for a project counted in thousands? With so many small jobs, the big job only hoped for - not promised - and so many communications problems, does it really make sense? Have you actually calculated how much per hour on average you're making from this client? Tot up every minute of your time spent on them over a month - not just translating/editing but on phone calls, emails, waiting around for possible work, filling in forms, etc, etc. And then see how much they've paid you per hour of that time. For all your principles, I suspect you may actually find you've been working for peanuts. Add to that the very great likelihood of an enormous mess and consequent non-payment due to the poor communication. Is it really worth it? Do they even pay promptly? I have a client who sends very many small jobs, and some of them really are tiny. However, the (French) communication has been slimmed right down to: Client: Hello, Can you edit this for 2pm tomorrow? Me: Fine. . . . . . Me: Here's your revised text Client: Thanks As the admin involves simply creating one line in my spreadsheet and copying that line into the monthly invoice, the actual hourly rate is fine. Also, the invoice is always paid within a week or two. I fear it would be a very different matter with this client you're currently dealing with.
No, they are actually prompt payers. The amount of time I spend on little tasks such as preparing invoices etc is not that huge. It's the PM "surprises" that get in the way (like the one that happened today). And that it takes them about 5 minutes on the phone to say one simple sentence in English.
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Lingua 5B wrote:
... It's the PM "surprises" that get in the way (like the one that happened today). And that it takes them about 5 minutes on the phone to say one simple sentence in English.
Even if they have a horde of ever changing PMs (which is not a good sign in itself, IMO), they shouldn't have as many VMs. If you could get ahold of a senior VM, you could probably sort this out with them.
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Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 11:28
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Mirko Mainardi wrote: Lingua 5B wrote:
... It's the PM "surprises" that get in the way (like the one that happened today). And that it takes them about 5 minutes on the phone to say one simple sentence in English. Even if they have a horde of ever changing PMs (which is not a good sign in itself, IMO), they shouldn't have as many VMs. If you could get ahold of a senior VM, you could probably sort this out with them.
I did talk with their accountant about this and I can see a slight improvement, but it's still not like it was before. Will try to find the VM, that's a good idea, thanks Mirko.
| | | | | Not so much principles as business sense | Sep 19, 2016 |
If the monetary compensation isn't worth the hassle, a polite "please remove me from your database" will solve this issue for good. To answer the question, I've lost projects like this, but in the process gained peace of mind and time to seek out other prospects.
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 11:28
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
SBlack wrote:
If the monetary compensation isn't worth the hassle, a polite "please remove me from your database" will solve this issue for good. To answer the question, I've lost projects like this, but in the process gained peace of mind and time to seek out other prospects.
Business sense says stay, other sense says go away. I had so many complicated dealings with them that I can't even remember everything, but I think at one point I did tell them to remove me if they don't have medium or big projects. Of course, they just ignored it, like my 10 other emails asking the same thing. The only thing I can do in that respect is to block their email domain, but surely they will not remove me from their database just because I ask them to, not them.
Oh wait, silly me. I block their email domain, and then they phone me. LOL ha ha. PM No. 3456. English style No. 5324956. Phone harassment.
[Edited at 2016-09-19 15:50 GMT]
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