| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4] | Is this dishonest? (Company offers to pay commission to translators who refer work to them) Thread poster: Tom in London
|
|---|
John Fossey 
Canada
Local time: 10:13
Member (2008)
French to English
+ ...
| What's the problem | Feb 23, 2017 |
Tom in London wrote: I have just received the following email addressed to me personally, from an agency in Ireland with which I have never worked. On the face of it, this seems like a very underhand attempt to pay me to create work for the agency. Is my impression correct? Has anyone else received this? Dear Tom, We have updated our Home Page at www.XXXXX.com to give it some more colour. Enjoy! We also remind translators on our database that where they are asked for jobs which are not in their language pair(s), they can refer the work to XXXXX Translations, and we pay the translator who refers such work to us. See www.XXXXX.com/index.php?id_page=156 Kind regards, Mr X, XXXXX Translations, IRELAND t./f. +0000 0000 0000 www.XXXXX.com An internet enterprise of professional translation services [Subject edited by staff or moderator 2017-02-22 14:14 GMT]
I came across this thread and am having a hard time understanding the problem. Every business needs people to bring them clients, or they will soon be out of business. Does it really matter who those people are, whether they are dedicated sales professionals or anyone else who knows the industry? And obviously if anyone brings a company new business they should be compensated for it, most commonly by a commission and sometimes by a flat finder's fee. The practice predates affiliate marketing, which is just a modern name for it - it has been common practice, out of necessity, since time immemorial.
| | | | | Referral fees/sales commissions vs. kickbacks | Feb 24, 2017 |
Bryan Crumpler wrote:
You don't have to like the marketing method, but it's not dishonest: you're not vouching for the quality of their business. It's simply a way of marketing for them without being on their payroll or being their agent or even having to believe in their product.
If a client comes to you asking for your services, and you are unable (or don't want) to do it, what is the harm in saying, "Sorry, I am not available to do this project, but perhaps XYZ might be able to assist." You can even follow that with "I can't vouch for their services, though.", if that eases your anxiety.
I think this is the point. If you seem to be vouching for the quality of the business and are receiving money (or other compensation) from that business for doing so and you conceal this fact, then that is dishonest. The concept of "kickbacks" is also older than affiliate marketing: You need to either make it clear that you are not vouching for the company or you need to make it clear you are being paid for what you are doing.
If Tom was complaining that the specific example described at the beginning of this thread seemed dubious (a company unknown to him offering him a financial incentive to [presumably] recommend their services), then I have to agree with him. It sounds more like a fake product review than a legitimate referral among professionals, although appearances seem to have been deceptive in this particular case.
On the other hand, I have absolutely no problem with this kind of practice in general, if it is done in a legitimate way.
I regularly receive requests for services that I don't offer. A German editor once insisted on paying me a referral fee of 6% for sending work her way. I've never had a similar experience, but I think that it was probably a sound business decision on her part, even if it didn't bring her any more work through me. And I could actually recommend her services, because I had worked together with her and spoken with her several times before that.
There is also a translator who does a lot of work in my field and translates into German, but not from German to English, and we refer a lot of work to one another. No money changes hands, but the relationship involves an obvious financial advantage, so I always make sure to explicitly state that this situation exists when I send a potential client his way.
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:13
Member (2008)
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER | Recommendations | Feb 24, 2017 |
I may occasionally recommend another translator because I know they are good at their work. But not if they ask me to recommend them - and certainly not if they offer me money to do it.
If you are happy to take money in exchange for recommending another translator, you are creating a terrible reputation for yourself. I don't think that's difficult to understand.
Thanks to Michael for making this distinction very clear. "Affiliate marketing" is just a fancy way of sayin... See more I may occasionally recommend another translator because I know they are good at their work. But not if they ask me to recommend them - and certainly not if they offer me money to do it.
If you are happy to take money in exchange for recommending another translator, you are creating a terrible reputation for yourself. I don't think that's difficult to understand.
Thanks to Michael for making this distinction very clear. "Affiliate marketing" is just a fancy way of saying "kickbacks".
[Edited at 2017-02-24 09:29 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | John Fossey
Canada
Local time: 10:13
Member (2008)
French to English
+ ...
| Kickbacks vs. commissions | Feb 24, 2017 |
As I understand it, a kickback is an illegal/unethical payment made to someone who has authority or influence over the buying decision. A commission is made to someone, usually a salesman but can also be a finder, who uncovers a business opportunity and may work to persuade the buyer, but has no actual influence, other than persuasion, in the buying decision.
A translator who knows that company X needs, say, a EN>FR translation when he only does FR>EN has uncovered a business opport... See more As I understand it, a kickback is an illegal/unethical payment made to someone who has authority or influence over the buying decision. A commission is made to someone, usually a salesman but can also be a finder, who uncovers a business opportunity and may work to persuade the buyer, but has no actual influence, other than persuasion, in the buying decision.
A translator who knows that company X needs, say, a EN>FR translation when he only does FR>EN has uncovered a business opportunity, but has no influence over whether agency Y will be able to make that sale. If agency Y makes the sale, it can pay a commission to the translator for the benefit of learning about the business opportunity.
As far as I can see, it would only be an unethical kickback if the translator had authority over the decision by company X to place the order with agency Y.
"Affiliate marketing" is just a fancy way of saying "kickbacks".
If this were true, then every salesman, advertiser and every other form of marketer, which are essentially the same, are also unethical.
[Edited at 2017-02-24 13:00 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | |
|
|
|
clairetransl (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:13
French to English
+ ...
| I don't see how it's dishonest | Feb 24, 2017 |
Tom in London wrote: Jenny Forbes wrote:
Having read the comments here, I'm coming round to the view that perhaps this agency's offer is not so fishy as I originally thought.
I see, for example, that Nationwide (the UK building society/savings and loan company) is offering its existing current account holders £100 for introducing a new current account holder. The new account holder also gets £100 (subject to certain conditions). I suppose that's not unethical, is it? I don't like this marketing trick at all. It tries to exploit my personal friendships by offering me a discount or some other incentive, in exchange for inviting them to sign up for something. This recently happened to me when I switched energy providers and as an incentive, I was offered cash if I would also get a friend to sign up. Sorry, but my friends are not for sale. I find this idea very disgusting - although in today's world, being disgusting seems to be the new normal.
Honestly, I find this mentality really strange. It's not selling your friends. If your friend wants to switch energy provider, it's a win-win for all concerned. Your friend gets a sign-up bonus, you get a referral bonus and the provider gets a new customer. The only way I see it as being dishonest is if you don't tell your friend that you'll get commission for referring them.
| | | | | Recommendations | Feb 25, 2017 |
I have occasionally recommended other translators (some are Prozians) to agencies and direct clients for language pairs or subject matters with which I don’t work, but I’m quite happy to do it for free and I wouldn’t dream of ever asking money or being paid for that, if for no other reason because it would be an accounting nightmare…
| | | | | Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4] | To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator: You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request » Is this dishonest? (Company offers to pay commission to translators who refer work to them) | Wordfast Pro | Translation Memory Software for Any Platform
Exclusive discount for ProZ.com users!
Save over 13% when purchasing Wordfast Pro through ProZ.com. Wordfast is the world's #1 provider of platform-independent Translation Memory software. Consistently ranked the most user-friendly and highest value
Buy now! » |
| | CafeTran Espresso | You've never met a CAT tool this clever!
Translate faster & easier, using a sophisticated CAT tool built by a translator / developer.
Accept jobs from clients who use Trados, MemoQ, Wordfast & major CAT tools.
Download and start using CafeTran Espresso -- for free
Buy now! » |
|
| | | | X Sign in to your ProZ.com account... | | | | | |
Login to reply/comment 
Translation news
